Pls recommend good and affordable NAS for home use

Discussion in 'Other hardware discussions' started by Alucard, Jul 3, 2013.

  1. zChris

    zChris Active Member

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    @King

    Good info up there, thanks.

    Questions:

    1. What is the bottleneck here? The speed on the SSDs? Or the processors? Or the wireless connection of the devices to your LAN?
    2. Were you running your NAS on one ethernet port or two with link aggregation?

    In other words, if you were running with link aggregation, would the transfer speeds have been any faster?
     
  2. King

    King Active Member

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    1GbE is the bottleneck of the SSD & 3.5" 10TB Skyhawk. Both drives exceed 125MB/s.

    For the 2006 MBP the bottleneck was the 2.5" 80GB 5400RPM HDD as the platter density and RPM are both low making throughput about half of 1GbE. For a 2.5" HDD to saturate 1GbE it needs to be 7200RPM or faster & 1TB or larger.

    Notebooks benefit the most from an SSD upgrade as they use fraction of the power thus lengthen battery life and speeds up response time, random reads/writes and maxs out throughput. Be aware Macs that old have a SATA link limited to 1.5Gb/s which saturates 1GbE by 1.5x but cannot hit their potential of 6Gb/s.

    Today 10GbE might be seen as excessive but the 2017 iMac Pro is the first Mac with it.

    [​IMG]

    10GbE equals USB 3.1 and Thunderbolt 1 at 10Gb/s. It exceeds the speed of SATA 6Gb/s, USB 3.0, 1GbE and Firewire 800.

    Expect Macs 2018-onwards to have it as well. 2018 Macs may also get USB 3.2 that equals Thunderbolt 2 at 20Gb/s.

    So 2018 Macs could have USB 3.2 (~2.5GB/s), Thunderbolt 3 (~5GB/s) & 10GbE (~1.25GB/s)

    Expensive today it might be a good idea to buy a switch & NAS with built-in 10GbE or is 10GbE-ready if you want it to be relevant by the year 2038. The first Mac with 1GbE was the 2000 Power Mac G4.

    A 50GB file would be transferred in ~8 minutes with 1GbE and ~50 seconds with 10GbE. While a 100GB file would be transferred at double those times. Times are applicable if Ethernet is the bottleneck and not the drive.

    With my NAS I used a single port only. No need to go dual port as none of my Macs have more than one 1GbE.

    You can increase Ethernet performance further but turning off packet signing for SMB 2 & SMB 3 connections. I hope it would allows for 125MB/s up and down for 1GbE and 1.25GB/s for 10GbE.
     
    #482 King, Jun 7, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2018
  3. King

    King Active Member

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    QNAP Launches New AMD Quad-core 4/8/12-bay TS-x63XU Rackmount NAS Featuring Single-port 10GbE 10GBASE-T Connectivity
    [​IMG]

    https://www.qnap.com/en/news/2018/q...ring-single-port-10gbe-10gbase-t-connectivity

    If I had a rack and knew about 10GbE being present in the iMac Pro I would have bought the 4-bay TS-463XU. I would then not have bought the 20TB WD My Book Duo.

    It also comes in 12-bay TS-1263XU that @Juice needs.

    HDD not your fancy? Want to hit 10GbE speeds? Then give The Synology FlashStation a try.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

     
    #483 King, Jun 7, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2018
  4. Leeger

    Leeger Well-Known Member

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    Are those nas drives such as wd red and seagate ironwolf worth their price?
     
  5. Leeger

    Leeger Well-Known Member

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    Are those nas drives such as wd red and seagate ironwolf worth their price?
     
  6. oj88

    oj88 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    As compared to what?

    The price is irrelevant if you need high-capacity drives that are designed for use in a NAS enclosure.
     
  7. Leeger

    Leeger Well-Known Member

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    Compared to a typical desktop hdd. I’m planning to use them in a NAS setup but will only be use to dump my photos there. I read that some people are using regular hdds in nas and they are pretty much okay.
     
  8. oj88

    oj88 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    All I can say is, I've tried using WD Green high-capacity, desktop drives in a NAS environment (24x7 operation) and they failed quickly. I've never had that problem with the WD Red drives.

    I now have six (6) WD Red disks. The youngest drive has been spinning for about 2.5 years. My two oldest drive has been spinning for 5.7 years, with no signs of letting up. The rest averages around 4.5 years old.

    Here's an article that directly answers your question: https://nascompares.com/2017/09/08/...and-standard-hard-drives-is-it-all-a-big-con/
    And here's a more 'human-readable' article why NAS drives are better in NAS enclosures: https://www.seagate.com/as/en/tech-insights/why-nas-hdd-master-ti/
     
  9. Leeger

    Leeger Well-Known Member

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    ^^
    Do nas drives ran 24/7 even when not being accessed? And are you using RAID? If so what RAID are you using?
     
  10. oj88

    oj88 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    This depends on the specific NAS drives' firmware and probably the NAS enclosure's logic itself.

    I run mine on a Windows Home Server 2011. It's almost constantly being accessed so they don't spin down. I have my CCTV NVR on it (motion detection), as well as Plex Media Server, among others.

    I also don't use RAID. I run a utility called Drive Bender, which is like Storage Spaces. It pools all physical drives together, whatever their size, then present it to the server as a single volume. It's kinda like JBOD. The difference is, it allows me to designate directories that can be duplicated to at least two physical drives for redundancy (in case a physical drive broke down).

    I do have a 'near-proper' NAS as well, sort of. It's an HP Gen 7 Microserver. It runs XPEnology (Synology DSM). I use it to backup the main server. It uses the surviving remnants of my WD Green drives (with bad sectors and all) in an SHR RAID with Hot Spare.
     
    #490 oj88, Sep 9, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
  11. jologs

    jologs Member

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    I use a synology DS916+ with wd red drives in RAID5 and I haven’t shut down the NAS for more than a year now but I restart it once in a while. There’s an option to allow the drives to hibernate after a set period of idle time.
     
  12. Leeger

    Leeger Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all your inputs!
    My plan set up is really very basic and simple:
    Synology ds218+ plus 2 4TB WD red on a RAID 0
    They are going to be used primarily to store all my raw photos. It will be the main drive where I’ll import my albums to Lightroom. I read raid 0 improves the hdd performance but you are riskinh losing all your data in both drives even if just one drive failed. I’m willing to take that risk as I’m going to back up all the photos to the cloud anyway.
     
  13. zChris

    zChris Active Member

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    I used to use the usual Seagate Barracuda drives as they were cheaper. Almost all my Barracudas failed almost exactly at the three year mark. Reconnection counts would appear first, then a few bad sectors a bit later, then the whole drive would fail shortly after.

    There was one instance where Disk 4 of my 5 bay NAS started showing reconnections and a few bad sectors. I left it for a couple of weeks while I was finding the best deal on a new disk. Within that time, Disk 5 started showing the same issues. I then promptly replaced Disk 4 and initiated a RAID rebuild, with the intention of doing the same to Disk 5 immediately after completion. Unfortunately, Disk 5 failed while my Disk 4 rebuild was still in progress and I lost all my data in the NAS. Both failed disks were activated at the same time and were three years old. I basically started from scratch and setup the whole box and disks as a new NAS. Good thing I have a backup NAS so I just restored the backup from the secondary NAS to the primary.

    I have since switched to Seagate NAS drives. Some of them are Ironwolf and the other earlier ones are Seagate NAS drives purchased before the Ironwolf product line came out.

    The drives are all still less than three years old but I am not seeing any reconnections so far so I think they are worth it.
     
  14. gaol

    gaol Well-Known Member

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    Is it ok to mix and match different brands of NAS drives?

    One of the two Seagate Ironwolf 6TB drives in my Synology DS916+ NAS was just tagged by the NAS with "imminent drive failure" and must be replaced immediately. My concern is: I just got these two Ironwolf drives and the NAS just a little over a year ago. In contrast, all the WD Red drives in my older DS414 NAS are still ok--two of them bought in 2015 and two in 2016.

    This makes me think of sticking to WD Red all the way from now on.
     
    #494 gaol, Sep 10, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2018
  15. zChris

    zChris Active Member

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    I cant answer your question on mixing and matching brands. However, I have been told a number of times that Seagate has a pretty good in-warranty replacement policy. I believe that the warranty period is three years so your drive should be qualified, but I don't know how to activate it, though. If you decide to go the warranty claim route, perhaps you can post your experience here.

    Thanks.
     
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  16. oj88

    oj88 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    I personally try to stay away from Seagate. Most of the drive failures that were catastrophic was made by Seagate. By catastrophic, it means that it was working fine one minute with SMART reporting an all-green status when out of nowhere, it would just suddenly quit. Before you've had any chance to recover anything, the drive dies with nothing to show for other than the infamous clicking sound... like it's mocking you. This usually happens after restarting/rebooting the machine.

    My experience with WD had been the opposite... They seem to fail more gracefully. Towards the end of their life, they start showing more bad sectors, but still remain operational. Never had one that just "crashed".
     
    gaol likes this.
  17. gaol

    gaol Well-Known Member

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    Will do. I did call Millennium Technologies and the process that they explained to me seems relatively straightforward--just like the RMA process for Western Digital. I'll post mar further impressions once I actually go through the process. Cheers!
     
  18. gaol

    gaol Well-Known Member

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    I'm also very partial to WD for so many years now, and it shows in the number of WD drives I've purchased (42 products currently registered on WDC both personal and for work) vs Seagate (5). Out of that many, I've RMA'd maybe 2 or 3 WD drives. With Seagate, this would be the 2nd out of 5 drives.
     
  19. lamski

    lamski Well-Known Member

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    Saw a video of the "Storinator" a few days ago. I'm wondering if these products could be purchased locally: https://www.45drives.com/
     

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