Coronavirus Disease (COVID-19)

Discussion in 'General OT' started by imart, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. hitme64

    hitme64 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    ^We simply cannot. Even for a month the economy will be in recession, what more in 6-12 months. While we as a nation value the undeniable right to life we must take into account the future of our generations and the life that they will live in. That many say there must be a balance would in the long run be untenable. How can a nation sustain its economic viability in the face of this pandemic lockdown by utilizing all its resources to defeat it? Maybe it can but for how long can we endure, how long can the working class endure, how long can the economy endure? Which brings us to the question: which is paramount then, the continued health and safety of the people or the need to open and free the economy from the lockdown to be able to sustain us again?
     
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  2. raypin

    raypin PhilMUG Addict Member

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    mm...achieve a balance. What that balance is (between saving lives and saving the econmy) nobody knows. What I do know is, and I ve said this many times in this thread sometimes heatedly, the hospital system will be overwhelmed and doctors will have to make choices: who lives or who dies? Which patient gets life-saving ventilators? Which one doesn’t? I m pessimistic that even with the current ECQ, the flattening of the infection curve will not be enough to allow the hospital system to catch up. It is a question of allocating extremely limited medical resources vs the overwhelming number of patients needing medical care. Example: if 1,000,000 Filipinos get infected in the coming months, 200,000 will need medical intervention. How? There is just no way. Quarantine works if given enough time but to give it enough time to work, you need to feed a 100 M Filipinos for as long as possible.

    So, given that, the answer seems to lie with herd immunity.
     
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  3. ice

    ice PhilMUG Addict Member

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  4. docnico

    docnico PhilMUG Addict Member

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    The British are the ones who thought of using the herd immunity approach, but they have abandoned it since last week, after realizing that this will lead to tens of thousands of deaths.

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/17/britain-uk-coronavirus-response-johnson-drops-go-it-alone/

    If one can find a way to read the Imperial College report from London, the best approach is still strict quarantine.

    We also have to take note that majority of the examples of successful herd immunity in history were achieved through the aid of vaccination (small pox, polio, some strains of flu, etc), and not by deliberately infecting the population.
     
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  5. raypin

    raypin PhilMUG Addict Member

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    mm..everyone wants a vaccine but minimum 12 to 18 months from what I ve read. Then assuming it passes all clinical trials and considered as safe to use, how long before a vaccine or several vaccine can be produced in sufficient numbers? The demand will be global. Countries that develop it first will most surely use it first for their citizens, leaving us on the ignore list.

    I understand the quarantine approach but I am also thinking of maintenance of the social order. At this time, only the rich countries have seen massive infections. Covid 19 is just starting to infect the Third World. Africa, Indonesia, India etc. The potential to infect massive numbers is there. In India, they have imposed quarantine rules. That is 1.2 billion people. How long will the government last there if food supplies become scarce because of quarantine? Hungry people = violent people.
     
    #1285 raypin, Mar 29, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2020
  6. docnico

    docnico PhilMUG Addict Member

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    Yes, no nation can afford to lock down for 12 months. Based on the experience of other countries, the bell-shaped curve will peak at 4 weeks, and the whole curve will go down in two months. China has completed this cycle. Italy is likely at its peak. US and Philippines will likely peak in 1-2 more weeks. The most viable scenario is quarantine for 1-2 months, then once the number of new cases go down, resume work with still some social distancing. If there’s a second wave (God forbid), then lock down again for a month, and repeat the cycle again until vaccines become eventually available.

    If we do nothing (allow the natural course of the disease), this will lead to millions of fatalities. We’re not just talking about Covid here, but all those diseases requiring urgent care and ICU admissions (think of the strokes, MIs, vehicular accidents, etc) will now become more fatal because there is no place to bring the patients.
     
    #1286 docnico, Mar 29, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2020
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  7. jetan

    jetan PhilMUG Addict Member

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    [​IMG]

    we have overtaken Thailand. more test to come.
     
  8. jetan

    jetan PhilMUG Addict Member

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    [​IMG]


    usual Sunday in HK.
     
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  9. piedad

    piedad Well-Known Member

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    Am not advocating to let the disease take its destructive path, but what am saying is that the pandemic will not end until more than 60% of the population get immunity - either naturally or through a vaccine. Unfortunately the vaccine is a year away at best so we have to manage the natural course by making it as slow as possible while we identify the treatment necessary.
     
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  10. Mykolant

    Mykolant PhilMUG Addict Member

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  11. raypin

    raypin PhilMUG Addict Member

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  12. pochiman

    pochiman PhilMUG Addict Member

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    Can I just say that this thread's been pretty awesome. I just love this thread. I can almost see this having a Slack channel of a spin-off at any moment. This brings the best minds out of the woodwork. Some comments also have a tendency to drive some of us mad (all in good fun!), and some are just plain hysterical, highlighting random pockets of idiocy, if not a bit too often in their occurrence that might have otherwise gone unnoticed unless shared here. Keep'em coming amigos. Thanks aplenty! :")
     
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  13. docnico

    docnico PhilMUG Addict Member

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    https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/29/politics/trump-coronavirus-press-conference/index.html

    Trump extends the US lockdown to April 30. I have a feeling the same thing will happen here. The main difference is that the US government will be giving each taxpayer $1200 each if they are earning less than $75k annually as part of a stimulus package.

    Meanwhile, here in our country, volunteer doctors who will be assigned in Covid hospitals will be given $10 per day.
     
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  14. Sir iAco

    Sir iAco PhilMUG Addict Member
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    Some U.S. Cities Could Have Coronavirus Outbreaks Worse Than Wuhan’s
    How Bad Is It Now? Cases Per 1,000 People
    The New York City area has more known cases per capita than any other metro area in the United States.
    Confirmed cases per 1,000 by metro area

    Metro area
    Population cases Per thousand
    Dig deeper, more charts upload_2020-3-29_21-35-18.png to explore: nytimes.com

    How Bad Could It Get? Growth Rates Over Time
    The number of cases in the New York area is still growing quickly.
     
    #1294 Sir iAco, Mar 30, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  15. Sir iAco

    Sir iAco PhilMUG Addict Member
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    I'm going to the city that never sleeps if I can find a nurse or a respiratory therapist to go with me. ;)
    For-hire nurses get big bucks to work in NYC during coronavirus outbreak
    nypost.com
     
  16. Sir iAco

    Sir iAco PhilMUG Addict Member
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    How coronavirus cripples the New York Mafia
    https://nypost.com
    Cough-a Nostra

    The coronavirus has succeeded where lawmen like Bobby Kennedy and Rudy Giuliani failed for more than a century — by putting the freeze on the mob.

    Way to go, COVID-19!
     
    #1296 Sir iAco, Mar 30, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  17. Cmmig

    Cmmig PhilMUG Addict Member

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    [​IMG] Coating doorknobs with copper foil as COVID-19 prevention

    By coating the doorknobs of its Taipei building with copper foil, the Ministry of Science and Technology (MOST) said it hopes this small step could help minimize the risk of the COVID-19 coronavirus infection.

    https://focustaiwan.tw/society/202003260010

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
    #1297 Cmmig, Mar 30, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  18. hitme64

    hitme64 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    YAASSS! Finally! Somebody is putting some damn sense into this community quarantine and calling everyone to rise up, go out and be infected. It’s our inalienable right to infection and such human right cannot be curtailed, not by a lockdown, curfew or quarantine. Attagirl! ;)
    A96E3D3F-D25A-4EE0-87B8-42D45523061C.jpeg
     
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  19. hitme64

    hitme64 PhilMUG Addict Member

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    ^Meanwhile, in Vancouver, at exactly 7PM each night, residents honor and applaud their frontliners for doing their jobs. How can they fall victims to human rights abuses committed against them, being locked down and forced to stay at home and still want to honor these "abusers"? They should have someone like our heroine Sarah Elago to rile the masses and show contempt and disrespect to government efforts because, you know, she is the best there is for saving our lives.

    And further meanwhile, in Italy, the battle seems to be losing as more and more patients are dying. Nearly 10,000 deaths already and the Italian health care system is failing.
    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...mic-a9431956.html?utm_source=digg&jwsource=cl
     
    #1299 hitme64, Mar 30, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
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  20. jetan

    jetan PhilMUG Addict Member

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    [​IMG]

    722k as of today
     

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