Unlocked iPhones in France & Germany = Unlocked Firmware for US?

[archeronfire]

Hi!

Im a newbie to this community but been a guest for quite a while. The guys here are very helpful and accomodating.

Would just like to know your thoughts on the up and coming release of unlocked iPhones in France & Germany (I think next week)...

Does the release mean we would be able to get the firmware of these unlocked iPhones and copy it to our iPhones? Meaning our iPhones will be unlocked legit?

Your thoughts please...

Thanks.

[morphine]

my opinion is if ever apple sells unlocked iPhones in the States then probably we are looking at the same price as france which is around $1500 or probably cheaper since goods in the EU tends to be more expensive.

[archeronfire]

Sorry for misleading post.. I meant us as in us Filipinos... Hehehe! So Sorry...

[mikaelrules]

Apparently Apple unlocks the phones by IMEI numbers, so I don't think it would be possible to just copy the firmware from an unlocked phone.

[Ranma]

Apparently Apple unlocks the phones by IMEI numbers, so I don't think it would be possible to just copy the firmware from an unlocked phone.

Yup, and supposedly they check the status everytime you sync your unlocked phone.

[archeronfire]

But you must agree that it would be a lot easier for programers to find a way to trick the system so that it would appear that the IMEI number of our phones here in Manila would look as if they were that of unocked iPhones..

Just a thought.

Hopefully we can someday soon experience the freedom of being able to update normaly on itunes without bricking or re-locking our iPhones... Am currently on 1.1.1 and am having my reservations on updating to 1.1.2. Looks like a lot of work..

[benzng]

Actually from what i gather it would be harder to "trick" the system since they are using IMEI to compare it.

As Steve Jobs said it will be a cat and mouse game. This will continue unless you will become a legit iphone subscriber.

But you must agree that it would be a lot easier for programers to find a way to trick the system so that it would appear that the IMEI number of our phones here in Manila would look as if they were that of unocked iPhones..

Just a thought.

Hopefully we can someday soon experience the freedom of being able to update normaly on itunes without bricking or re-locking our iPhones... Am currently on 1.1.1 and am having my reservations on updating to 1.1.2. Looks like a lot of work..

[Ranma]

You'll have to pay a premium price for the unlocked phone (999 euros) and this is what you'll get (posts from hackint0sh).

This is what's supposed to happen:

They send the IMEI of your phone to apple and they put the phones on a whitelist.

After 24h you can activate the phone via itunes..

1. you go to a local T-Mobile shop and ask for an unlocked iPhone for 999 Euro
2. the sales person calls a special number at T-Mobile to pass on the IMEI for the iPhone to be unlocked (alternative: the customer calls but it isn't recommended because it could delay the process)
3. T-Mobile sends the IMEI of the iPhone to be unlocked to Apple
4. Apple flags the IMEI on their servers as "unlocked"

Meaning: the "unlocked" iPhone works with the same firmware and baseband like the locked ones, there is no difference. The difference happens during the activation process where Apple sends some sort of IMEI-dependent code to allow all SIM cards.

Here's the catch: EACH TIME you connect the iPhone to iTunes, the code is re-checked to make sure that this iPhone is authorized to be unlocked. This "check" doesn't happen locally with iTunes but it happens remotely on the Apple servers, meaning that it is almost impossible to program some sort of keycode generator to fool the activation/registration process of iTunes/Apple servers.
Theoretically (actually it IS possible), Apple could remove the unlock from the currently sold unlocked T-Mobile iPhones if they want to, for example if the court dismisses Vodafone's allegations. Of course they won't do it, T-Mobile can't afford to sell unlocked iPhones and then re-lock them again, this would not hold up in court and it won't happen.

and here's one user's experience so far with buying one:

More than 24 hours have passed since I got the unlocked iPhone and the unlock hasn't been activated yet, I still get the "unsupported" SIM card message when connecting the iPhone to iTunes 7.5 (of course I did a full reset of the settings before I made the connection). I read somewhere that in some cases it took 28 hours or more for the activation process, this actually indicates that this is a very "complex" story, not just an easy "generate a code" unlock. It is very likely that only ONE person at Apple or ONE department is allowed to issue unlock flags for the IMEIs, so this may be an explenation why it takes so long. I actually don't know the reason but right now I'm a little bit p.ss.d. My sales person communicated the IMEI of my iPhone to T-Mobile service in front of me, he repeated it twice and the guy on the phone also repeated it, so no mistake here possible. I just think that the unlock hasn't gone through yet, what a crappy method to offer an unlock. This also proves that Apple and T-Mobile don't like this situation at all, they do everything they can to make the unlock procedure a pain in the a.., annoying their customers.

Has somebody actually got the unlock activated, if yes HOW LONG did it take and how does it work when you swap cards back and forth?!

A short update: over 32 hours have passed...iPhone is still locked.
Maybe Apple is short on employees because of Thanksgiving but this really starts to annoy me. Selling an "unlocked" iPhone to a customer and have him wait "at least 24 hours" to get the unlock up and working is not only very questionable from the german court order point of view but also very customer UNFRIENDLY.
It also shows that Apple holds ALL the keys to the iPhone and the cell phone carriers are the "dumb" executers only, so this actually proves that Apple really knows how to do business. Incredible that a large telecommunications company would agree to their rules, especially since the iPhone, even if a success, doesn't really bring them (the carriers) huge amounts of cash.

Update on my "unlock" situation: over 45 hours have passed and nothing. The T-Mobile service employee told me that I just need to put the new SIM inside and it should work. When I told her that iTunes actually does the "job", she told me that I can't use iTunes with the new SIM, just telephony and SMS services. Ouch, she didn't have a clue. I started to be a little bit more blunt and she tried to connect me to Apple directly. Apple refused(!), they told her that this "issue" lies in the responsibility of T-Mobile. I had the feeling that T-Mobile and Apple aren't really friends regarding the whole unlock matter, apparently T-Mobile put Apple unter pressure after the court order. What can I say, T-Mobile doesn't seem to be ready for the iPhone but it is somehow excuseable since the unlock is something very new. I don't get however Apple's attitude in this matter, they refused to speak with the customer directly. Strange indeed.

update:

today i have been at the t-mob store the third time. NOW they are telling me that my imei has never been transfered to apple. so i have to wait another 24hrs

but here comes the best part:

i ask him about the missing edge settings and that i might not be able to use it with my eplus simcard for emails on-the-go. if that doesnt work its pretty mutch useless for me. he then told me that he is "not allowed" to cash back if this doesnt work cause my "imei is allready used". i would have to call t-mobile itself to try to get a refund. hear, hear...

in adition to the (not yet confirmed) fact that you will loose all data everytime you swap a new sim card in this is far away from a real unlocked phone. they might get in kind of a trouble with the german laws. i told him that the dealer will be held responsible for that, but again he just said that they are not allowed to give a refund for so called "used iphones".

i wonder if vodafone would care about such news. i am not hesitating to call their law department and see what they mean.

what a piece of crap all that....

Regarding the unlock: I talked to T-Mobile a couple of hours ago and like I said, they wanted to put me in contact with Apple directly but Apple refused. What a bunch of ... It was pretty obvious, the T-Mobile service woman on the phone was pretty upset and she apologized a couple of times to me. She promised to forward my IMEI again to Apple but til now, nothing has changed.
I slowly get the feeling that Apple doesn't want to unlock or just hopes that delaying and creating problems with unlocks may actually drive many interested parties from NOT going this path and NOT buying the 999 Euro iPhone. I really don't get it.

I decided to wait until Monday and if the unlock isn't working, I'm contacting the guy who actually sold me the iPhone. If after 24 hours after talking to this guy nothing happens, I will contact Vodafone Law Department and tell them the whole story. I'm pretty sure that this will be something they can use during the trial on Thursday and furthermore, this means that T-Mobile and Apple violated the court's ruling, resulting in a HUGE penalty fee for them (as far as I know, we're talking about a couple of hundreds of thousands of Euro here).

I still think that T-Mobile is innocent in this "charade" and that Apple holds the key to the whole unlock desaster but since Apple doesn't seem to want to talk to their (and T-Mobile's) customers, T-Mobile gets the blame.
My opinion about Apple hasn't improved over the past few days.

Looks like you'll pay a premium and still wind up with a premium headache. Reminds me of the activation fiasco during the launchdate of the iPhone.

[benzng]

interesting story. poor guy as he really wants to use the iphone badly and he paid legit for it. wonder how this story will turn out. iphone saga. =)

[Ranma]

interesting story. poor guy as he really wants to use the iphone badly and he paid legit for it. wonder how this story will turn out. iphone saga. =)

Well, not really. That guy's a moderator on their forums, and if I interpret his other post correctly, he already has 6 other working iPhones for him and his family.